主義 (ideology, -ism) and 主意 (idea)

[HashiriKata]

If someone says "rénmín yīnggāi yǒu quánlì" how can i tell if that person is saying "the people should have power" or "the people should have rights"?

A conversation normally does not consist just a sentence (such as the one quoted above). Besides, how the convesation came about is also an importance element for understanding what is meant from what is said.

[gato]

I heard a lecturer where a professor said the Chinese government needs more "quan2li4," not less as some have argued.

There was a debate among several of us afterwards whether he meant "power" or "rights." It didn't make sense that the government would need more rights, but it doesn't make that much more sense, either, that the government would need more power. I suppose he could have meant the power to enforce the law and such, though the problem there is not really the lack of power.

[Ferno]

A conversation normally does not consist just a sentence (such as the one quoted above). Besides, how the convesation came about is also an importance element for understanding what is meant from what is said.

what?? If everything needs to be totally predictable, what's the point of having a conversation at all? I hope there aren't too many words like this - creativity will be seriously impacted :o

[nipponman]

what?? If everything needs to be totally predictable, what's the point of having a conversation at all? I hope there aren't too many words like this - creativity will be seriously impacted :o

Don't be surprised at what hashirikata is saying, this is true of any language even english, some more than others, though. What do I mean when I say, "I can see that." Do I mean that I think something is possible, or that something is visible? We can only tell by context, not just this conversation, but the conversations before and the topic of the conversation. This is context. Context isn't words around a word (well, it is but not here), but the situation that the word is in. And if you still can't tell which word it is, just ask.

[Ferno]

??? "i can see that" = i understand the situation "i can see it" = i can see a specific thing

I understand context, but in this case (as proven by gato) we have 2 meaningful words that can be confused. Ultimately language is about transferring meaning. In this case, the written language asserts superiority again - because the words can't be misunderstood when you see the characters. This is incorporated into Chinese conversations a lot - I think in this case the person could say "blah blah blah... quan2li4, 'you3li4' de 'li4', blah blah..", right?

in any case, this is just one pair of specific words.

[Quest]

Ferno, here's what I have to say about your pursuit of Chinese: you will always find what you look for.

[HashiriKata]

I heard a lecturer where a professor said the Chinese government needs more "quan2li4," not less as some have argued.

There was a debate among several of us afterwards whether he meant "power" or "rights."

In stead of discussing what he could have possibly meant, I'd send him to the beginners class of "How to Communicate Effectively in Any Language".

(Unless he meant to be ambiguous, that is.)

[nipponman]

??? "i can see that" = i understand the situation "i can see it" = i can see a specific thing

Last time I checked, both were appropriate, though the latter may be more common. "I can see it" can also mean "I understand the situation/I can visualize what you are talking about", they are pretty much interchangeable. But even if you still disagree, I'm sure you see my point, context is everything.

[Ferno]

sorry - i've never heard it used like that. I've heard "I can/can't see it that way", but never just "i can see it" when speaking in terms of metophorical visualization. Or perhaps "i can/can't see it happening" with "happening" added or omitted at some point.

this example aside, "rights" and "power" are two different meanings. As we can see, an entire speech could be made with no context clues. There's a limit to how far context can go before you need to start using meaningful words. Otherwise we could just dispense with words altogether and make vague grunts and murmurs and just assume context will clear things up.

[nipponman]

sorry - i've never heard it used like that. I've heard "I can/can't see it that way", but never just "i can see it" when speaking in terms of metophorical visualization. Or perhaps "i can/can't see it happening" with "happening" added or omitted at some point.

Ok, assuming that "I can see it" is never used like I said above, hopefully you can still see that, "I can see that" is used in both ways.

"Look over there can you see that?"

"Yeah I can see that."

...

"I'ma be rich makin these chia pets...whadda ya think?"

"I can't see that."

[Sophia_Shang]

Quote:

I heard a lecturer where a professor said the Chinese government needs more "quan2li4," not less as some have argued.

There was a debate among several of us afterwards whether he meant "power" or "rights."

Never worry about quan2li4 means whether 权利 or 权力, many native speakers are frustrating about this, too!

I'm a student of China University of Political Science and Law, I saw many professors will turn to English when their students became puzzled at quan2li4 on a lecture about Civil law, so they will probably speak like this:

中国政府需要更多Power!

Then the students are often likely to burst into laughter.