Miscellaneous questions in context

[Jinxx]

Hi I'm new here. If anyone feels like giving me a hand with these, I'd be most grateful.

1)

Verbal series:

Is this a complement followed by a serial verb? If so, what kind of complement?

她靜靜地躺在床上看書

V Series?

我等一下兒再問他問題

V series? Was able to learn, and now can (speak) a few words?

一個西方人能學會幾個生詞...

Only learned (and now) can (read, use) pinyin..?

作為一個外國學生，只學會拼音和單詞…

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2)

I believe I understand the intent of the highlighted portion of this sentence, but its construct eludes me.

雖然這種所謂的考核是非正式的，但是這裏隱藏著中國文化在待人接物方面的很多學問，外國人能否與他們的中國同伴進一步溝通，在很大程度上取決于他們的“考分”。

Meaning: a lot of learnedness is concealed in this Chinese way of treating people?

這裏 Adverbial

隱藏著 V + Aspect

中國文化 Subject? or more properly, Topic?

在待人接物方面 Complement? Directional complement?

的很多學問 Headword. But it almost seems to include 中國文化

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3)

Are these 的 phrases? (ie, nominalizing the verbs).

They almost look like 是...的 constructions without the 是.

This is probably just a 的 construction I haven't run into in grammar books yet.

在和中國人交談時，用的還是美國人的思維方式。比如說，有的人在回答別人的恭維時…

[anonymoose]

3)

Are these 的 phrases? (ie, nominalizing the verbs).

They almost look like 是...的 constructions without the 是.

This is probably just a 的 construction I haven't run into in grammar books yet.

在和中國人交談時，用的還是美國人的思維方式。比如說，有的人在回答別人的恭維時…

The two 的s you highlighted in this sentence have different functions.

As for the first one, 用的還是美國人的思維方式, I think you were along the right lines regarding nominalizing the verb. This sentence means, "what's used is still the american person's way of thinking".

verb + 的 means "what is (verb)ed", or when the does of the verb is explicit, "what (doer) is (verb)ing", eg.

1) 她吃的是苹果。 What's she's eating is an apple.

2) 他说的都是废话。 What he said/is saying is all rubbish. = Everything he says is rubbish.

This form is actually a kind of abbreviation, where the object after 的 is often omitted. For example, in sentence 1 given above, 吃的 is an abbreviation of 吃的食物, and could be said as

3) 她吃的食物是苹果。

but 食物 is unneccessary here, as it is obvious from the context.

In this constuction, you may also find 所 before the verb, often in more formal situation. The meaning is the same.

=========================================================

Now, as for the second 的, 有的人在回答別人的恭維時…, this is just a set phrase 有的 meaning 'some', so 有的人 means 'some people'.

[sd2237076]

2)

I believe I understand the intent of the highlighted portion of this sentence, but its construct eludes me.

雖然這種所謂的考核是非正式的，但是這裏隱藏著中國文化在待人接物方面的很多學問，外國人能否與他們的中國同伴進一步溝通，在很大程度上取決于他們的“考分”。

Meaning: a lot of learnedness is concealed in this Chinese way of treating people?

這裏 Adverbial

隱藏著 V + Aspect

中國文化 Subject? or more properly, Topic?

在待人接物方面 Complement? Directional complement?

的很多學問 Headword. But it almost seems to include 中國文化

這裏 Subject

隱藏著 V (Predicate)

很多學問 Headword (Accusative)

中國文化在待人接物方面(的) is 很多学问 's attribute.

[Jinxx]

First, thanks to both of you.

1)

Anonymoose:

you may also find 所 before the verb, often in more formal situation. The meaning is the same.

Such as:

不知所當為

有所不知

And in so far as it's a relative pronoun, it's related to the passive, as in:

被水所淹

為匪所殺

Is that right?

2) sd22:

這裏 is the subject? as in agent, doer of the predicate?

Even so I don't understand the rest, namely what the 在 is doing.

這裏隱藏著中國文化在待人接物方面的很多學問

It would have act as a nominalized verb with an object (is that possible?); so it would read, literally: Here (this?) conceals the learnedness of (the fact that) Chinese culture is in this way of treating people?

whew.. it's still not clear to me.

[HashiriKata]

這裏 is the subject? as in agent' date=' doer of the predicate?

Even so I don't understand the rest, namely what the 在 is doing.

這裏隱藏著中國文化在待人接物方面的很多學問

It would have act as a nominalized verb with an object (is that possible?); so it would read, literally: Here (this?) conceals the learnedness of (the fact that) Chinese culture is in this way of treating people?

whew.. it's still not clear to me.[/quote']

First is my translation of 這裏隱藏著中國文化在待人接物方面的很多學問:

(Although this kind of assessment is not official,) it'd reveal how much the foreigner knows how to interact with people the Chinese way, (and how well he can get on with his Chinese colleagues)

這裏 is the subject? as in agent, doer of the predicate?

It's a kind of "subject" but it can also be said otherwise (Note that 這裏 is translated as "it" and 隱藏 as "reveal" in my translation, so nothing is cut and dried as the way you asked your questions seems to assume.)

Even so I don't understand the rest, namely what the 在 is doing.

在 here is "on/in": a great deal of knowledge on dealing with others (= 在待人接物方面的很多學問)

這裏隱藏著中國文化在待人接物方面的很多學問

It would have act as a nominalized verb with an object (is that possible?); so it would read, literally: Here (this?) conceals the learnedness of (the fact that) Chinese culture is in this way of treating people?

I don't exactly understand your question but the structure of this phrase could be analysed as follows:

{中國文化[在待人接物方面的(很多學問) ] }

in which

很多學問 = head noun

在待人接物方面的 = modifying the head noun "很多學問"

中國文化 = modifying the noun-phrase "在待人接物方面的很多學問"

And the whole sentence 這裏隱藏著中國文化在待人接物方面的很多學問 would be "it'd reveal how much the foreigner knows how to interact with people the Chinese way" (non-literal)

[HashiriKata]

Just noticed that your question 1 has got no response:

Is this a complement followed by a serial verb? If so, what kind of complement?

她靜靜地躺在床上看書

Complement of Place (This is just a term, another term of similar meaning may also do.)

V Series?

我等一下兒再問他問題

Yes and no, depending on what you mean by "V Series". The sentence is actually a contraction of two separate ones: 我等一下兒 and 然后我再問他問題。

V series? Was able to learn, and now can (speak) a few words?

一個西方人能學會幾個生詞...

No, not V series (能: auxiliary verb; 學: main verb; 會: resultative complement.)

A transtation could be "A Westerner can learn a few words..." but since something is missing, it is not quite clear what is meant.

Only learned (and now) can (read, use) pinyin..?

作為一個外國學生，只學會拼音和單詞…

Your translation is not correct but since the quote is not complete, it's difficult to suggest an alternative.

[Jinxx]

1)

First is my translation of 這裏隱藏著中國文化在待人接物方面的很多學問:

(Although this kind of assessment is not official,) it'd reveal how much the foreigner knows how to interact with people the Chinese way, (and how well he can get on with his Chinese colleagues)

It's a kind of "subject" but it can also be said otherwise (Note that 這裏 is translated as "it" and 隱藏 as "reveal" in my translation, so nothing is cut and dried as the way you asked your questions seems to assume.)

Ah, very good. Perhaps literal translations are sometimes a bad habit; it's an attempt at structural clarity.

But that 中國文化 = modifying the noun-phrase "在待人接物方面的很多學問" surprises me. I assumed it was the subject of 在, which as a whole modified 很多學問. (are these two roles incompatible?)

Anyway this is clearly a lack of reading experience on my part. But thanks for the help.

2)

I was asking whether these structures are considered verbal series.

她靜靜地躺在床上看書

Because it has a complement, I guess this is more like the below, with an implied 'and'

我等一下兒再問他問題

But, you know, I'm asking not just to get grammatical labels; in many of these cases role determines meaning. right? ...

3)

Here's more context for one of those sentences:

(it's talking about how the 老百姓 might consider one student who learned Chinese well. However: ) 但是，作為一個外國學生，只學會拼音和單詞還遠遠不夠，也應該充分重視中國人的文化和語言。

I guess the 會 is a resultative complement here as well?

And btw, do the verbs link like this? : 作為 [consider] doing so little to be 還遠遠不夠 [far from enough], and consider it necessary to respect...

In other words, must 作為 be linked to 也應該 in order to make sense? Because the subject is 中國人 roughly, and they're not obliged to do anything here, right?

[HashiriKata]

Hi,

But that 中國文化 = modifying the noun-phrase "在待人接物方面的很多學問" surprises me.

You can assume that a 的 between the modifier and the modified is understood (since there's already one in the sentence), then it may be easier to see the relationship.

I assumed it was the subject of 在, which as a whole modified 很多學問.

Do you mean 在 here as a verb (such as in the sentence 他不在家) ? No, it can't be a verb here (But as an alternative to my previous interpretation, it's possible to consider 中國文化在待人接物方面 as one phrase, modifying 很多學問)

I was asking whether these structures are considered verbal series.

她靜靜地躺在床上看書

Because it has a complement, I guess this is more like the below, with an implied 'and'

我等一下兒再問他問題

Actually, the structures of these two sentences are different. In your terminology, the sentence 她靜靜地躺在床上看書 can be considered to involve a V. series (躺 and 看) while 我等一下兒再問他問題 is clearly a contraction of 2 simple sentences.

(If you'd like to use "verbal series" as a technical term, you should find some criteria to clearly differentiate the structures of the above 2 sentences. Another example of a sentence with a "verbal series" is: 我去寄一封信。)

Here's more context for one of those sentences:

(it's talking about how the 老百姓 might consider one student who learned Chinese well. However: ) 但是，作為一個外國學生，只學會拼音和單詞還遠遠不夠，也應該充分重視中國人的文化和語言。

I guess the 會 is a resultative complement here as well?

And btw, do the verbs link like this? : 作為 [consider] doing so little to be 還遠遠不夠 [far from enough], and consider it necessary to respect...

In other words, must 作為 be linked to 也應該 in order to make sense? Because the subject is 中國人 roughly, and they're not obliged to do anything here, right?

Yes, 會 is here a resultative complement. I'll try a translation as a simpler way to answer other parts of you question:

However, it's not adequate just to master pinyin and the vocabulary but, as a second language learner, one should pay sufficient attention to the culture and Chinese ways of speaking.

[Jinxx]

However, it's not adequate just to master pinyin and the vocabulary but, as a second language learner, one should pay sufficient attention to the culture and Chinese ways of speaking.

Okay, I see that 作為 functions here as 'as, in the role of'. That removes the problem.

Thanks, HashiriKata-san.