Warning: Cheated in China AGAIN HELP!!!!!!

[md1101]

ranran,

id be a little concerned about what they did to your passport. like did they frame you for something?? maybe its far fetched but you should definitely at least report the passport as stolen (from the time you gave it away so you cant say you had it during whatever they did with it). ALSO, if you do that, maybe some record will come up that says it was used as identity in the purchase of a car which could get those pricks busted.

i feel for ya as i can imagine the deal possibly being tempting and id hate to get dogged by my mate like that. thanks for the post. i know i wont be giving my passport away for ANYTHING now.

[gougou]

maybe some record will come up that says it was used as identity in the purchase of a car which could get those pricks busted

Should they get busted, it's your word against theirs concerning whether the passport got stolen or not... Might be a situation you'd like to avoid.

[dalaowai]

If money was your original issue, I recommend moving to Shanghai. There are plenty of teaching jobs that go between 10000 to 15000 RMB per month. You can also tutor Korean or Japanese students evenings and weekends. Tutoring wages are 200-250 RMB per hour based on experience.

I know a few people making 25000 RMB per month! You do have to give up socializing and stuff.

Unfortunately in China there are lots of swindlers, however there are lots of people willingly being swindled. I've been here over 3 years and I got swindled a few times, and I learned one thing: "Don't trust anyone!" It doesn't matter who they are, how well you know them. Just trust yourself. Many foreigners in China are in China because they're messed in the head. Many foreigners are in China to make a quick buck as well. Everyone is playing the game and the sly ones will end up being the winners. Good and honest people end up in the gutters.

[roddy]

And AEON F**K U!

I hate people who talk shit over the net.

Don't be a heckler

be a help if not shut the F**K up.

ran-ran

Aeon's post wasn't exactly helpful, but it was also pretty fair comment considering your post - you lend your passport to someone so they can commit tax fraud and then complain that Chinese businessmen aren't trustworthy? I'm sure you can see how ridiculous that looks. Regardless, an escalating response like that isn't acceptable.

And where does the Z visa come in? Your story doesn't make sense to me any more.

Friend of mine told me yesterday that they've been asked by people to lend them their passport for a car purchase. That was in Shandong so it's obviously fairly widespread (Randall in Shenyang, Imron's in Tianjin and now Shandong also). What's actually happening with the passport I don't know - I could believe it is used to purchase a car 'for export', which is then diverted, but if passports are coming back mangled perhaps something else is going on?

Roddy

[ord100]

I guess it works like this.

1) Car purchased in name of foreigner allegedly for export using borrowed passport.

2) PASSPORT STAMPED WITH DETAILS OF CAR PURCHASE FOR EXPORT

3) Car resold/registered to chinese owner who avoids high car taxes

4) Passport returned with stamped pages removed/replaced by counterfeit pages

5) Passport owner gets paid (payment optional!!)

6) If the government's tax system worked flawlessly the passport lender, the "original buyer", could have to pay a tax if the car were not exported when the buyer leaves china

I can see the motivation for this because car prices in China are high (compared to the US)

[roddy]

2) PASSPORT STAMPED WITH DETAILS OF CAR PURCHASE FOR EXPORT

Surely not - anyone doing import / export work would need a new passport on a weekly basis, no?

I've just emailed the UK consulate to see if they know anything about it.

[ask_weasal]

I dont know how it works but I trusted my friend....This thing goes all the way up to the mayor of shenyang. Roddy I dont really care you believe me or not. I have no reason to lie about this situation. But anyway I got screwed I think ill just forget about it but my main reason was to warn all of you to watch out for this scam its fairly popular now.

[roddy]

I believe something happened, but I don't think you've explained very clearly what happened. Where does the Z visa come in? What exactly did they do to your passport? Remove pages? Change details? If you coherently explain exactly what happened, other people will be better informed and more able to avoid it happening to them.

[trevelyan]

If these guys had the sorts of connections you seem to believe, they would hardly be resorting to cheating you out of a few thousand RMB. Or getting involved in a car smuggling scheme. It is also incredibly unlikely that the Mayor of any city is getting involved in petty crime targetting foreigners. These guys sound like petty thieves with lots of bluster.

So I actually disagree with most of the posts here. There are valid reasons to hand your passport over to people, the most legitimate of which is the very common practice whereby agents handle official document processing (visas, business licenses, etc.). So looking beyond the irony of the situation, the question is really whether you had any legitimate reason to have given this man your passport.

Assuming you do, go to the authorities. If there are any markings in your passport (or pages missing?) -- you really are facing identity fraud. God only knows what they did with your passport. And you should document the problem. Whatever these people used your passport for, if they really have connections they will doubtless use them to make the problems go away. But that will involve paying someone off, which is why their behavior is incredibly stupid.

I'd advise getting a new passport (you will need the older passport to do this), and then reporting the problems with the old ones to the authorities and going through the official paperwork to change your visa documents, etc. (they will probably take the passport). You will probably have to answer questions, but even assuming it really does boil down to your word against theirs... you aren't the one trying to cover anything up.

[imron]

Actually, I'm in Qinhuangdao, but the scheme's also in Tianjin.

For a little more info, below is a copy of a leaflet that someone passed on to one of the foreign teachers at my school to hand out to the other foreign teachers who work here.

I'm guessing the Z visa is needed because customs restricts the number of people who can import luxury cars at reduced taxes to those foreigners living and working here on a long term basis. After all, students and tourists should have no need for such things.

Anyway, here is the body of the leaflet....

----------------------

You may have heard about a program for teachers in which the teacher is asked to use his/her documents to assist Chinese car buyers to import luxury automobiles.

I was, and am, involved in this program as a partner in a Tianjin company that conducts this business. I have not only been a part of the process, but have assisted a number of your colleagues in Qinhuangdao and Qindao [Qingdao?] to realize benefits from the program.

I want to assure you that this is a LEGAL and GOVERNMENT SANCTIONED program to assist Chinese car buyers who might otherwise not have the opportunity to purchase the luxury vehicles they desire. The program has been successful for many foreign teachers with absolutely no illegality or residency consequences.

If you are not familiar with it, this is how it works.

You, as the foreign "assistant", are asked for the use of your Passport (Residency Z visa), and your Foreign Experts Certificate, to "import" a vehicle for a Chinese buyer. The use of you documents is a legal, government sanctioned action. Our company, which is based in Tianjin, uses your documents as the import device. You are NEVER either the "owner" of the vehicle, nor are you EVER responsible for the vehicles delivery. The only reason your documents are needed is to facilitate the fast delivery of the vehicle, and to circumvent certain taxes. You are NEVER asked to sign any purchase agreements of any kind.

In return for the use of your documents, you are paid a fee for service of 8,000 RMB. This fee is paid to you, in cash, at the same time your hard-copy documents are returned to you by our company.

Here is the step by step process:

- I, or another company representative, will meet with you to verify your documents. YOUR Z VISA/RESIDENCY PERMIT MUST HAVE AT LEAST 11 MONTHS BETWEEN THE 'ISSUE DATE' AND THE 'VALID UNTIL' DATE.

- On the day our company representative visits the export bureau offices, we must have the hard copies of your passport and foreign expert's certificate. Customs needs these to verify you exist.

-Once the customs paperwork is complete, usually within an hour or two, your documents and your fee are returned to you promptly.

That is really all there is to it!!

This program is now being run in Tianjin by at least three companies. The benefits to using my company are these:

1) You are working with an XXXXX [name of college left out] colleague, and IF there was ANYTHING illegal about this, I would never have gotten involved, nor asked you to take advantage of the program;

2)We can process your documents, and have them and your fee, back to you THE SAME DAY, in almost 100% of the cases. (Other companies can take as many as three or four days).

There is another thing you should know. This is a one time only process at the present time.

I would like to help you through this process.

----------

The leaflet then provides contact information for this person.

[roddy]

Interesting - Imron, do you know people who've done this successfully?

[imron]

[edit]

just re-read ord100's post. It seems I didn't understand fully the first time. I'd now agree that the cars are imported, but possibly on the condition they are exported when the foreigner leaves China - otherwise they have to pay the import tax.

[edit]

I would guess that ord100 has got it pretty right except that the cars are for 'import' not for export. So, a Chinese who wants a luxury car, but doesn't want to have to pay the import tax makes use of a foreigner's documents to import it on the cheap. The foreigner is paid a fee (far less than what the tax would have been), and then the Chinese gets a luxury car.

The reason importers/exporters wouldn't need to keep replacing their passports is because they would have to go through official, full tax-paying, channels which would probably require use of some other sort of documentation. Lacking such documention, these unofficial importers are left with hunting for foreigners with Z visas, as by the sounds of things, it looks like there is some kind of once-only tax exemption for foreigners living/working in China on a long-term basis who wish to import a car for personal use.

[imron]

I don't personally know of anyone who has successfully done this, but at the same time, the OP is the only person I've heard of who's actually gone ahead with the scheme. I've managed to convince anyone I know who was thinking about doing this that it would be a stupid idea. Seems that I wasn't far wrong.

[ask_weasal]

So roddy it looks like a quite an inticing deal. So there is nothing in being follish about this. I was told that it was legitimate also but as you can see I got played for the fool. So this is a warning dont do it. Even though the government says it is so....its not. You were warned

Ran ran

[geraldc]

The govt hasn't said they've sanctioned it, some bloke who's typed up and photocopied a flyer says they've sanctioned it.

If the Chinese govt wanted people to afford luxury foreign cars, they'd be better off lowering tariffs rather than making prospective buyers find a friendly foreign teacher with a Z visa...

[imron]

The government doesn't say it's legitimate, the people running the scheme say the government say it's legitmate - there's a big difference. The problem is how many foreigners who see this are then actually going to go and see what the law really says on this matter, especially if they hear about it from another foreigner that they know/trust.

Anyway, I'd be interested in hearing what happens next. I agree with Trevelyan. If your passport really has been altered/tampered with, you need to report this to your embassy and get it sorted out sooner rather than later.

[Lu]

(...)government sanctioned action. (...) The only reason your documents are needed is to facilitate the fast delivery of the vehicle, and to circumvent certain taxes.

The government sanctions tax evasion? Yeah right.

[adrianlondon]

The passport was probably carefully taken apart, duplicated, and put back together.

There may be a slightly chinese-looking clone of you walking around the US right now :-)

[roddy]

Funny, but last night I had my wallet pinched by this bloke who said he was a government-licensed thief, with a chain of command all the way up to Wang Qishan. Apparently for 2008 all thieves, pickpockets and slitpurses will need to be a member of the Beijing Illegal Occupations Guild.

I can see how people could fall for this, and I wouldn't be surprised if some people actually get the money. What I find hard to believe is that someone would get their passport back obviously tampered with in some (what?) way and not mention it to their consulate.

[Shadowdh]

So when I get to Beijing and the pickpocket comes up to me explaining he is govt sanctioned do I ask for some sort of card to let me know that he has good guanxi..?? (course if my wallet is taken then I cant get you that beer can I Roddy... )