Fascinated by Xinjiang..

[md1101]

i was doing some travelling around the globe today with good old google earth. i always thought xinjiang was just full of flat desert but how wrong i was.. seems xinjiang is covered in mountains some nearly 20000ft high. and also there is a huge smooth looking rock near the krygystan border... you know what i mean.. smooth compared to the other rugged mountainous areas. is there a name for it? if you have google earth youll know what im talking about it really stands out. its bigger than kyrgyzstan.

has anyone done much travelling around xinjiang and been to these mountains?

[bhchao]

found these photos of Xinjiang:

http://www.trekearth.com/gallery/Asia/China/West/Xinjiang/photo310537.htm

http://www.trekearth.com/gallery/Asia/China/West/Xinjiang/

[randall_flagg]

awed! amazed! that's what i am. this is the first time i'm using google earth and i about fell off my chair. don't know whether to laugh or to cry, so i guess i'll just cry! my gosh! do you realize a few decades ago, people would have killed for "maps" like this?

the only downside: there are some mistakes (like: Xiamen and Gulangyu have not been labelled accurately: Xiamen is now where Gulangyu should be at). Also, Pudong (Shanghai) is still kind of blurry: but I guess China changes faster than satellites can orbit the globe. Behold! The future is upon us!

[randall_flagg]

great pics! if all goes as planned, i'll be there in just 12 short months!

[yonitabonita]

Xinjiang is truly breathtaking. Next to parts of Iceland, I remember Lake Karakul, and the Mustag Ata on the Karakoram Highway as being the most spectacular scenery in the world (I qualify this outrageous statement by acknowledging there's about 200 countries in the world of which I've visited less than a quarter).

I planned an epic journey walking from Xinjiang into northern Pakistan once upon a time. Bad planning (on my part) and Chinese authorities thwarted my plans of staying in ethnic minority villages along the way - nevertheless, I highly recommend hiking along bits of the karakoram highway if you're into beautiful nature, and interesting culture. Back in 2001, there was very little tourism, which made it feel a lot more intrepid - even if it wasn't.

Crossing into Northern Pakistan is entirely doable, very worthwhile, and not too time consuming. I recommend using Skardu as a base and doing walks in the area. Or if walking isn't your thing, you might get into iceclimbing or a combination - mountaineering. K2 is just over the border.

Y

[gougou]

Chinese authorities thwarted my plans of staying in ethnic minority villages

How is that? Were those villages off limits or were you just not allowed to stay overnight?

[md1101]

yonitabonita,

what you're saying is the exact kinda stuff i would like to do. combination of cycling/walking/mountain climbing across xinjiang and crossing the pakistan border... sounds great. i know what ill be doing when im done with my degree now...

[Ian_Lee]

Xinjiang's scenery is indeed very breathtaking.

Even before reaching Xinjiang, the scenery on the railway along the Hexi Corridor -- one side is the endless Gobi while the other side is the towering Kunlun Mountain range, and dotted with numerous dilipdated fortresses that dated millenium ago along the railroad -- is really shaking for anybody.

And after the afternoon nap in the hot summer, riding on the ox-driven cart in Turpan was also kind of exotic.

And no matter wherever I went, hordes of Uighur kids were following us. (I went there in the early '80s -- don't know if they are still curious.)

And visiting those Kazakh nomads in Tianchi (Celestial Lake) gave me the illusion that I was in Switzerland.

Everyone should visit Xinjiang at least once in his life time!

[bhchao]

Authorities have decided to ban filmmaking at scenic spots in Xinjiang for fear of environmental damage. http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/asiapcf/05/17/china.films.reut/index.html

It says that CTHD was filmed in Xinjiang without permission.

I have always been fascinated with Xinjiang, Sichuan, and Yunnan provinces.

[Language Guy]

Mick,

As a geographer, I was disappointed that I couldn't immediately answer your query. So I looked around a bit, and have found it.

As I firstly suspected, the "rock" you mention is not a rock, but a desert. It's the Taklamakan desert. I'll spare you the drivel and simply link you to the Wikipedia article.

Here it is:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taklamakan

Enjoy, everyone.

[yonitabonita]

Quote: "Chinese authorities thwarted my plans of staying in ethnic minority villages "

After having walked 20 kms on the first day, I saw a little village and went about asking people if there was a place I could pay to stay at. All I needed was some sleeping space that was warm. (It's freezing at night - even in the summer time) I offered to pay for the effort. People scrambled around for about 2 hours shuttling me here and there. They spoke a Ugyhr language I didn't understand, but I got the vibe that there were going to be some difficulties. Anyway, in the end some guy that could speak mandarin told me that the Chinese army that were stationed nearby regularly patrolled the area making sure there was no trouble. Locals were not allowed to take foreigners in, and if they were caught, they'd be punished. He motioned a gun to the head. Whether there's a death penalty attached or not, I couldn't persist in risking people's livelihoods for my little adventure holiday. So, that's what I mean by Chinese authorities thwarted my plans.

I've subsequently learnt that private tents are allowed. Though you'd want to check that info before you go. This all happened in 2001 afterall.

Go go go!!!!!

[yonitabonita]

Mark Driscoll

If you're planning on going, just remember that the pass is only open on certain summer months of the year. The rest of the time it's closed off because of the heavy snow in the area.

Unless you're a really experienced mountaineer, I'd really suggest that you get a guide in Skardu. No, actually, I'd suggest you get a guide even if you're really experienced. As you know, there are some big mama mountains there that can be troublesome. I made a friend in Skardu that's had about 30 years of experience of mountaineering experience. After having talked to about 15 different people/groups claiming they could guide me out to K2 base camp , I figured he was the most honest and competent. In the end, I chose not to go to K2 base camp. There were too many stories of people leaving their trash along the way. Ali worked out a route that got me to a no-name, no-cache glacier, but at 6,000 mtrs was still challenging enough for my girlie self. He had crampons and ice axes etc.. anyway, I was entirely satisfied with his service and if you like, I can put you in touch.

It should go without saying that I have no financial or other interest in Ali's business.

Y

[md1101]

wow interesting story... particularly the possible death sentence for taking in a foreigner hmm.

thanks for the advice. i wont be heading to xinjiang any time soon but if/when i do i would indeed like to contact you.

[badr]

i couldn't agree more as far as Xinjiang in concerned. I spent 5 days there last week out on the western side, fairly close to the border with Kazakhstan and let me tell you... it was amazing!

first of all, the cultural mix that is happening there is nothing short of a melting pot... Kazkh, Uighurs, Mongols, Han as well as an extra 10 minorities have managed to mix their respective cultures and it shows in the food, the dress and even the sounds and smell in the street.

The scenery over there was also unexpected! Every time i heard of Xinjiang, it was related to the Gobi desert and the kebabs... what i saw was beautiful mountains and clear sky, breath-taking sceneries i tell you.

Let's not forget the fact that Cheese is actually part of the culture there... It so enjoyable to just head to the store and find fresh cheese for under 5RMB...

I put some pictures in my flickr account:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/lostinchina/

[nephridium]

Informative post by yonabonita about the 'authorities'. Thanks for that. Travelers may run into similar situations even now. I think one thing is that the locals feel a certain responsibility especially towards foreigners, they understandably don't want anything 'to happen' and then get blamed for it (e.g. if you get sick, break you leg, get lost or whatever), so the situation is a bit complicated for them and they may ask the local authorities what to do, to be on the safe side.

I went tenting in Inner Mongolia and had no problems whatsoever. Often my biggest "problem" was to find a nice tenting spot free of 羊粪 ;). Once in a while you'll have people inquiring about who you are/what you're doing etc. It may be wise to learn a few sentences in the local tongue, depending on how 'far out' you'll be traveling, (especially when you could be mistaken for a Han Chinese) to make it clear that you're just a tourist from another country, so they won't need to be afraid you might steal stuff or worse.

Haven't been to Xinjiang yet, but would love to go tenting there as well. It's such a huge place though, wouldn't know where to start. Btw, how is the availability of horses in Xinjiang? Are there still herds running wild? They are just a gorgeous sight! In Inner Mongolia the number of wild horses decreases rapidly, which is unfortunate because they have been a part of the culture and defined the character of the land and people for the last few centuries (not to mention the Mongolian horses are just extraordinary creatures).

Tenting or outdoor hiking is great in China, because you don't need to be wary of wild predators (except for the very south towards Vietnam maybe). Unfortunately it seems to be impossible to find good (topographical) maps.

P.S. "wild horses" in Inner Mongolia means they are running around freely and may have not been 'broken in', but as far as I know every horse still has an owner. I guess it's similar in Xinjiang.

[jiaoshou]

I would like to ask the group who have been around Xinjiang what their experience was like linguistically?

Did you know any local language besides Mandarin? any Turkic/Altaic language? Was that even important?

Most of this thread is about the natural beauty of the region. I am particularly interested in visiting and experiencing some of the Muslim communities of contemporary China. As for the urban centers: Urumqi, Turpan, Kashgar. Were these places that you could imagine hanging out for a few weeks? Studying?

[yonglin]

If you would like to interact a lot with locals, it will greatly help if you learnt some Uyghur before you went. Many, many people will not speak Chinese at all. If you just want to enjoy the natural scenery, you'll get around practically using only Mandarin. For instance, many hole-in-the-wall type eating places will have a menu with Uyghur on one side and Chinese on one side, so even if they won't understand what you say, you can point and they'll understand what you want. Otherwise, learning to say ban-mian, kao-rou or zhua-fan (you'll end up eating this 80%+ of the time) in Uyghur won't be too much of a problem. Many Uyghur people in more tourist type places (e.g., Turpan) are bilingual and will be fantastically enthusiastic to teach you some Uyghur. Xinhua bookstore carries two books with tapes on learning Uyghur (in Chinese).

Oh. Actually, I would suggest that you do not travel on your own, since going to many places will require you to get a driver with a car (no public transport). If you're always on your own, such costs will add up.

Turpan has very much of a small-town feeling. However, I had the best yoghurt in Xinjiang there, so I might consider living there for that reason alone. Urumqi is a large city, very polished and shiny, many Han people. I would definitely consider living there - one of the nicest cities in China, in my opinion. This is your last stop for Chinese food. All Chinese food I tried beyond Urumqi was awful. Kashgar is probably the most Central Asian you can get - you'll see loads of women wearing burqa-type clothing and there are some neighbourhoods where time has really stood still. Many people realised this already, and you'll see a lot of Western tourists (the city isn't all that big, so they won't be as spread out as in Urumqi). Overall, I remember the place as quite dusty. I probably wouldn't like living there, but if you want to study Uyghur or the like, it's probably a great place to be. Avoiding the main tourist spots, it's probably quite genuine.

Oh... I just watched the movie "Kite Runner". It features a lot of Xinjiang natural scenery, around Kasghar and up to Tashkurgan. It also contains some shots from the old town of Kasghar. Check out the pictures on my boyfriend's blog (he's a zillion times better taking pictures than I am) so that you know what to look for.

[simonlaing]

Part 1 ( I got carried away as usual)

The most mind blowing places in Xinjinag was TianChi lake a few hours from Urmuqi.

Up the side of the mountain, a mini van and chair lift and you step out next to this blue long lake nestled in Mountains with Snow still visible in late May.

This is Kazak rather than Uigher country. Most of the restaurants have types of lamb, beef and yogurt. After following the crowd of CHinese tourists we were with on the Han operated golf cart tour to the traditional Kazak round huts. We back tracked and for the Kazak horse tours. My brother and I took a horse ride up a side of the mountain for a 3 hour ride. (They offer 3-4 day tour up a mountain as well but we had limited time. )

The Kazak tour guide was an interesting guy he had passable English and fairly good mandarin. During the ride he talk about major conflicts between the Han golf carters and the Kasak horse riders. They put a huge tax on Horses like 50,000 yuan a year or something. And restricted where they could ride (not along the road around the lake where tourists naturally take. Also there were issues about ticket booths available for the golf carts but just an area with some kasak guys milling around. We had to ask 4 han people where the place was. They(the han zu golf cart drivers) also quoted a price that was ridiculously low even for China.

[simonlaing]

I also went to Turpan Grape valley and it was quite good in historical tourism, like walking through Greek Ruins, whole cities ruins but without the pillars.

Wandering around Urumuqi, (the night market is cool as was the homemade ice cream) Someone tried to talk to my unshaven brother in Russian until we corrected him. There were several times we were able to speak to people in English as well which was interesting. I would recomend spending a significant time there, it was incredible. (Ranks up with Victoria Falls, and Mont Blanc in the Alps.) big and Beautiful.

I will probably go back in a year or two it was great!.

have fun,

SimoN:)

[DrWatson]

After having walked 20 kms on the first day, I saw a little village and went about asking people if there was a place I could pay to stay at. All I needed was some sleeping space that was warm. (It's freezing at night - even in the summer time) I offered to pay for the effort. People scrambled around for about 2 hours shuttling me here and there.

Sounds like something straight out of Kafka's The Castle.