Chinese Dating Question

[Sir_Zerp]

I’ve been seeing a Chinese grad student for about four months. Both of us are 30 something years old.

I’ve noticed that we only go out about once a week, and the dates generaly last about 90 minutes, movies, dinner, etc.

No real outward signs of affection; in fact the only time we hold hands is when we go dancing.

My question (I’m not Chinese), is this normal?

My middle aged dating experiences are so completely different than this, I think this behavior must be is one of the reasons I like her.

Any Advice?

[dalaowai]

Are you in China?

This is somewhat strange behaviour, although she might be really traditional.

If you're in China, she probably doesn't show any affection due to the fact that other Chinese will repeatedly refer to her as a "working girl".

Some Chinese girls prefer having a "weekend boyfriend", as they're concentrating on their careers.

Some Chinese girls have many boyfriends, therefore she might not have too much time for you.

She also might think that you're not serious, therefore she's taking it slow to make sure that you're not just wanting a fling.

In my experience, all women are truly confusing, regardless of their nationality. ;)

[doumeizhen]

Try asking her.

That would be my advice, but note that my parents are both psychologists and I am single, so take it with at least three grains of salt. No matter what her story is, there is a chance that you are both at a point where you want to know where this is going, and if its on your mind enough that you ask us, you should definitely ask her. The thing is, both men and women are not only confusing critters, we are also awkward, shy, dumb and selfish (and tons of fabulous things too, but that isn't where I am going with this). The options are many, and they've been addressed by dalaowai, here are some others: she might see you as a friend, and really enjoy (just) that, and be afraid to tell you this, because it risks a very comfortable arrangement.. That, or she is one of those women that really understands that men are in it for the chase, and she is using it to keep you around (a hard pattern to break out of!, especially since you seem to be enjoying it). Or, of course, it could be anything in between, including her being afraid of being misjudged if she were to iniate anything.

You know, I'm not sure my two cents are the best solution. Dalaowai makes some good cultural points, but perhaps there are some universal things that apply.

Ultimately, the solution my parents have taught me is to trust your instinct, they tend to be right, and be willing to accept them and work with them even if they are telling you something you don't want to hear! If there is still any confusion, ask her, and go back to step one of trusting your instincts when listening to their reply.

Of course, if your instincts are telling you anything other than what you want to hear, and you like this arrangement, then don't ask her. But if you are becoming emotionally invested and its putting your happiness at risk, then it might be better to break from the arrangement before it becomes a habit.

Now, Sir_Zerp, chances are I've told you things you already know, but you should also know that its great that you are making an effort to understand this girl and the cultural reasons shes enveloped in.

[md1101]

dalaowai... 'some chinese girls have many boyfriends'

I know.. and i reckon its strange! because chinese girls generally give me the impression they are innocent or at least try to be. (im not referring to the chinese girls that hang around expat bars).

i know this girl who seems really prim and proper. she's cute. is an assistant food and beverage manager at a hilton hotel (in china). seems to have a lot of values. yet she tells me she has many boyfriends..

i guess it is innocent in a way still because a lot of girls wouldnt say that out of fear of being labelled a slut... and i KNOW if she got called that she'd be really upset.

i can't imagine this being too common though so to the original poster i wouldnt worry too much about that being a possibility

[HashiriKata]

yet she tells me she has many boyfriends..

I doubt that she used the word "boyfriends" in the same way it's normally used in the West (Just guessing anyway )

[md1101]

yeah i myself tried to think of some excuses for her.. but her english is quite good and she must know its the translation of 男朋友 which they wouldn't use lightly either...

lol.. anyway i assume you are somewhat right coz im guessing she wouldnt be sleeping with them.. that would be too wierd

[dalaowai]

Yeah, I have some close Chinese female friends and I was surprised that quite a few of them had two or three boyfriends. These are platonic friends who happen to watch American TV shows such as Sex in the City.

It seems to be popular in Shanghai, as it's always good to have Plan A, B and C.

My ex had 3 boyfriends and I fortunately caught her. Heartbreaking, yes, but it was a good life lesson to learn. An almost nerdy-like, goody-two shoe that I would of NEVER imagined she was playing the game. She played it well and kept two other guys in reserve. I'm proud to say that I was Plan A....or wait...that made me the biggest sucker. haha. I even found a myspace account with postings which broke and sickened me.

So yeah, if your girl has a myspace account, she's up to no good.

Cheers!

[pandaxiongmao]

Are there any private investigator services targeted toward foreigners? I know that other countries like Thailand have private investigators that will check up on "girlfriends" you suspect might be cheating, for a fee. If there isn't, it seems like it would be a good business to enter...

[Sir_Zerp]

"In my experience, all women are truly confusing, regardless of their nationality" - Dalaowai

"solution my parents have taught me is to trust your instinct, they tend to be right" – Doumeizhen

I guess my fear was maybe I missed a obvious page or two, years back when my professor covered that eight page chapter on Chinese culture.

I’m overseas by the way.

She is a beautiful and well educated woman; my instincts are that she is doing some ‘cultural surfing’ just checking out some of the local flora and fauna.

In matters of the heart, there are no easy answers.

My primary objection to the ‘Ms. Ice’ routine, (which strangely I liked) is if she is going to take that much time, why not take the whole tour?

Thank you for your responses.

[md1101]

i feel for you dalaowai,

come to think of it i had an english mate in xi'an that was dating a chinese girl who had another boyfriend. he knew about it though. she basically wanted my mate for 'fun' and her chinese boyfriend was there as marriage material. she said she didn't love her chinese boyfriend but that he would make a good husband.

i wonder if there is something deeper going on with a 小公主 thing possibly coming into it. putting themselves FIRST in other words.

i also think there is probably some credit to what you said about them being influenced by western shows like 'sex in the city' and giving it more credit that we do.

the main thing i find interesting is when you first get to know chinese girls you get the impression that western girls are WAY more open and flirty etc and that chinese girls are so innocent. YET i think that these days as the chinese culture seems to be becoming more and more like the infectious western culture they sometimes go overboard in trying to emulate what happens in western culture - the information of which they get mostly from tv shows and hollywood celebrity news which isnt really a good reflection on western culture but which they are made to think is cool none the less. so when it comes to boyfriends i think they have lost a lot of that old tradition which many claim to still have.

i used to talk to chinese girls about how western girls were more open and theyd wholeheartedly agree until one day i thought.. wait a minute.. nearly every chinese girl in the dorms from my uni had a boyfriend and whenever one would break up with one i swear theyd find someone else within a couple of weeks.

i have more to say but im just procrastinating from studying for an engineering exam i have tomorrow. better get back to it

[KIWIBOY]

Trust me mate, if you are at the point of writing to these forums to understand your chinese girlfriend, give her the flick now, before you get your head even more screwed up. Don't get into the habit of i) trying to understand them or apply logic - it won't work ii) justifying their behaviours in your mind - because its not okay if you don't feel comfortable.

I dated a chinese girl for 2.5years and in the final analysis I was trying to justify her spoilt brat behaviour that it drove me nuts. Worse is if they come from a one child situation and/or Shanghai. I and another male friend agreed that our chinese girlfriends major focus was .......on themselves and generally had little feeling for their partners thoughts or concerns in the relationship.

If she really wants to be with you, try this - don't call her - simple and effective and it might save you from the heartache I went through.

[Lu]

Sir Zerp: have you tried making a move yourself? She might be too shy (or afraid to seem too eager). Asking her is also a very good idea.

[mr.stinky]

"30 something" your girl is pre-MTV/dress like a slut

"go out about once a week/dates about 90 minutes/No public displays of affection" normal

oh, yeah, and dates can be made/broken with 30 minutes notice.

"the only time we hold hands is when we go dancing." this is true for the young girls

too, but usually they are fondling your crotch on the dance floor, and forget about it

once the music stops.

"is this normal?" for here, yes.

[wushijiao]

I’m not sure you can really draw any conclusions about Chinese culture from any one particular dating experience with a Chinese girl. The country is too diverse and varied, and everybody is different, of course. But most importantly, there are no real “unwritten rules”, which, to some degree exist in the US.

The Seinfeldian rule holds that only 5% of the population is datable, regardless of country. I’m not saying any particular person you meet you should dump. But in cross-cultural relationships, communication is the key to solving any subtle unconscious assumptions, I think.

[trooper]

Sir Zep,

Treat her as a woman, rather than as a Chinese woman. Interpret her actions as you would any other woman. Forget about the so-called cultural differences. Chinese women are as passionate and open as any others if they want to be and their feelings are strong enough. In relationships, we overestimate the significance of external influences. It's easier to blame these than to face the unpleasant truth that the problem comes from ourselves or our partners.

Looking at your situation, I can think of 4 likely explanations for what's going on. You'll have to decide which one's the most likely. 1. She is dating other men at the same time. 2. She is using "The Rules" or something similar, to ensure that you the compliant type, who will be the faithful, obedient husband who won't step out of line. 3. You are too much the "nice guy" who doesn't know how to take the lead or is afraid to do it and escalate the relationship to an intimate level with her. 4. In her eyes, you are just a friend, not a lover.

[Florencia]

Wow. I was amazed by reading all this...I am from Argentina, South America...the other side of the world. And I am planning to go to Beijing in September to study chinese for a year...

You have talked about chinese women...how is it with men? If girls use to have 3 boyfriends..do men have at least 5? Do I have to be aware??

I'm not used to it!. Argentinian guys are pretty loyal...I could never put my hands in fire for any of them (that is a translation of spanish actually...) but at least I know them, I get their codes...if you understand what I mean. But being for the first time in Asia and dating an oriental guy...Hope I just don't fall in love!!

So, how is it? Are there here any women who can talk about their experiences?

Thanksss

Flori

[yearningf]

Hi Flori.

I've been dating this local for more than a month now..And he actually sort of proposed to me? check out my thread at Im having a dilemma now on how to deal with him because I really dont have any idea on how they are when it comes to dating especially with a foreigners like us..

Please peeps, share your POVs..