Chinese degree value

[outcast]

How would getting an undergraduate degree in engineering from Nanjing University and a graduate degree from a good american university help me or hurt me when it comes to getting a career?

[onebir]

there are some world uni rankings here:

shanghai jiaotong uni's rankings and here:

compiled for the times higher educational supplement

the thing is, nanjing isn't in the top 200 in either ranking (its 3-400 in the shanghai jiaotong ranking). but the good american unis are in the top 100. so unless the engineering faculty at nanjing is particularly well known, i'm guessing it might be hard to get in to do the graduate degree...

i also heard (from someone who should know - she's promoting australian unis in china) that it's generally hard to get chinese degrees recognised abroad (or at least in australia).

[outcast]

According to the top graduate one NJU is ranked 150. You are right about the other one. I have heard that degree's from NJU are not accepted unless you take some extra courses.

[heifeng]

Although, not really familiar with your situation, it appears NJU isn't a 名牌 university, also in terms of engineering it may not even have greatest resources/funding, which is a nice thing to have for an engineering major. I've known people who have obtained masters degrees at Chinese universities (not necessarily engineering but some science and humanities areas) and later those masters degrees were not recognized in the US when they applied for their Ph.D's. Most people I know who came to the US with an engineering degree from China came from Tsinghua or one of the technical universities in Harbin....that being said, with any major recruiters may have existing opinions of what kind of (engineering) students a university outputs: the theoretical ones, or the practical engineering ones....ie. analysis, or hands on lab work...maybe you want to consider what you want to do in the long long run...are you in a position where you can attend a better Chinese university or a university in the US w/o paying international student fees?

[outcast]

NJU is famous, just maybe not so much in western countries at the moment. It is one of the key schools in China.

At this point I am unsure if I can study anywhere in China. I've lived in Nanjing for more than a year now and I do like it very much. I don't know if I can get scholarships to study. If i can't get scholarships, I will have no choice but to go back to the US for my undergraduate degree.

EDIT: One of the other reasons I am considering this is because I believe that in the future, China will become very important in the fields of science and engineering. I think it would be useful to be able to do engineering in Chinese and in English. If I go back to the US, it is unlikely that I will have enough time to learn engineering in Chinese.

[heifeng]

So you are applying for to start in the 2007/2008 term? Wouldn't you be applying to numerous schools anyway? I seems that the cost to attend college in China would be cheaper that in the US even if you are paying extra tuition to the Chinese univesity just from everyday expense savings...

Have you checked out the school itself/ engineering facilities? City aside, it's always nice to check out the school where you will be spending the next 4 years of your life....especially in engineering.....

[outcast]

Yes, the tuition is cheaper, but in the US I could get loans to cover it.....here I can't.

Of course I would look into what facilities the school has for things like this, but if my chances of getting full scholarships are minimal then why bother? I can't attend a university in China without them.

[heifeng]

Got it...

Technically you could probably still get loans but just not at the lower government educational loan interest rate, you would have to take out a personal loan....probably the lack of grants would hurt the most...

if I may ask, what state are you a resident of in the US? you don't have to answer...

[outcast]

Oregon. I used to go to Oregon State University for 2 years, but the tuition practically doubled in that amount of time and so I felt that it wasn't worth it to stay. Plus I wanted to come here anyway.

There are just so many factors I'm trying to consider here, and possible value of the degree is one of them.

EDIT: According to the Shanghai list, all of the chinese universities score very highly when it comes to the research output. What do you think that indicates?

[heifeng]

Well, I don't think I can offer much help, but wish you the best of luck. It's always challenging for engineering students to get out to study abroad since there's a bunch of set curriculum so it's difficult to transfer or get credit for courses taken at different universities....

[outcast]

There is no point in tranfering either, all of the undergraduate majors are taught in chinese. I don't know "technical chinese" at all. I already have some background in engineering, which will help me a little.

Location of the school does matter a lot. One of the things I hated about OSU was that it was practically in the middle of nowhere sounded mostly by farmland (there was a very small city, but it was way too hick-ish for my tastes). I'm just too much of a city person I suppose.

I believe that Chinese schools will improve their ranking. The schools here have taken a good look at that list and they are asking themselves "what's wrong with our school?" It is only a matter of time before it gets better.

As for getting the degrees accepted, if I went to a chinese school other than Beida, Qinghua, or Shanghai JiaoTong, I would need to take extra courses. Maybe it the end the extra effort will pay off, but I am still deciding if it would.

[gato]

I've known people who have obtained masters degrees at Chinese universities (not necessarily engineering but some science and humanities areas) and later those masters degrees were not recognized in the US when they applied for their Ph.D's.

PhD programs are different. Many top American PhD programs don't even recognize Masters from other American schools, though you may be able to transfer some of the coursework or skip some. I think almost all American universities would recognize a Bachelor's from Nanjing University if you were applying for a graduate program. I'm sure a sizeable percentage of Nanjing graduates go to the US for graduate school every year.

Your Nanjing GPA, however, would be hard for them to evaluate and thus your standardized test scores and perhaps research would be more important. One factor to consider is that it might be very hard to get good grades in Engineering at Nanjing. Nanjing is a top-20 university in China. See this ranking. Its engineering students are bound to be very, very good at math and physics -- probably comparable to the average student at MIT. So it's probably going to be a lot tougher to get good grades at Nanjing than it was at Oregon State.

[outcast]

I never expected it to be easier. I did check with the student loans people to see if I could get a student deferment, and they said yes because NJU is an accredited university.

[Qingdao Frank]

Hello all,

just to add a bit about studying engineering in Chinese.

My own background is that I have a Masters in Chemical Engineering (2:1) from Nottingham University in the UK. Also spent one year of my studies at Bucknell University in Pensylvania, USA.

In the final year of my studies I attended the 'milkround' presentations by all the big international companies, Shell and Exxon (oil), GSK and Zenneca (drugs companies), HSBC and City Bank (Banking). Usually the people in charge of graduate recruitment came along and at the end of the presentations stayed around for students to ask questions.

At the end of each presentation I asked the same question:

'I am going off to China to study Chinese for two years then afterwards want to come work for your company. What are my chances?'

And actually the response everywhere was good. The woman in charge of shell recruitment chatted to me for about 20 mins with lots of other students still waiting in line.

It seems at the moment speaking chinese is pretty special, particularly in the UK where the immigrant chinese population generally speaks cantonese.

[gamerfu]

Probablly Hong Kong for UK citizens would be better to study Cantonese than Mainland. UK still has their foot in the door in HK.

[novemberfog]

If you are going to try to find a job in China with a Chinese company and are willing to earn the same pay as a Chinese engineer, then going to a Chinese school would be fine. However, if you want to work in China with foreign-owned companies, they are going to prefer foreign university degrees for non-Chinese, and probably even work experience in your own country if you want to join the global elites like investment banks and what not.

Another thing to think about is that a majority of the top engineering and science students who are Chinese wish to do their studies in the UK, Australia, USA, Canada, and mainland Europe. They leave China to do this, and I am sure there are multiple reasons, and I am sure it is not that Chinese schools are bad...largely though, I think it is just that employeers look at foreign degrees in a better light, and can command more pay when looking for work in China, or trying to find work abroad. Just something to consider I guess.

[mrtoga]

Welcome to the boards Qingdao Frank.

May I ask if you are already in Qingdao? Are you studying Chinese language there or an engineering course? (I ask because HIT in Harbin offers doctorates in engineering subjects to foreign students - they can take the courses in English and apply for scholarships as well, wondering if universities in Qingdao do the same.

Actually I was in Qingdao yesterday, and the weather was fantastic. Qingdao is right up there with Dalian on top of my list of favourite Chinese cities!