Most powerful portable Chi-Eng-Chi electronic dictionary (most number words/chars)

[gato]

Still it would be nice to read a review of the SSD - someone on this planet must have bought it!

It seems that it's only being sold in Korea.

http://www.gopaultech.com/2006/05/look-mom-no-hard-drive-samsungs-q1-ssd/

[griz326]

Here's the link to the story about the units power consumption at 5 hours.

http://www.ultramobilepcs.com/

This new phase of mobile computing will revolutionize everything - so far - the pundits have not figured out that these machines are not palm pilots or ipaqs. If you click the compare link you'll see Samsung will be releasing another unit next month.

Oh....and they are being sold on eBay:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Samsung-Q1-Ultra-Mobile-PC-UMPC-SSD-Flash-version_W0QQitemZ170022963650QQihZ007QQcategoryZ39980QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[smalltownfart]

Since you are only considering an older Palm, your price estimates for Option 1 is extremely out-of-whack. You can usually get older PalmOS devices at bargain bin prices.

Look in eBay or a local craigslist (or equivalent) for a used/refurbished item.

You should also factor in ease-of-integration with your lifestyle.

It is much easier to carry around a smaller unobtrusive device that fits in your shirt pocket, which you can whip out any time you like. I always carry my PDA with me, and I get a lot done with my flashcards & reading any time I am idle. You may find it surprising how often this happens.

This UMPC is amazingly small but since we are talking about power consumption in terms of hours, I wonder if you will end up having to carry a bunch of other stuff as well, such as extra battery packs, and a charger/power adapter.

[griz326]

I've followed this thread with interest because on my next trip to China I will write another book. While I can do it on the Palm....... So I added Wenlin software to my desktop PC to see how it works... As great as Pleco is on the Palm TX, Wenlin within a PC interface is much easier to work with.

Were price irrelevant and battery life were no issue, the UMPC is clearly the better choice for real work.

Traveling outside of the major cities makes battery life a HUGE issue. Still, I am now watching Samsung's development of the UMPC closely. If they conquer the battery life issue then it is no contest - I will buy a UMPC.

[smalltownfart]

As great as Pleco is on the Palm TX, Wenlin within a PC interface is much easier to work with.

Can you provide some feedback about what you think is lacking with the PDA option? Bear in mind, with the UMPC, you will also be working mainly with a stylus. I admit that I have never tried to write a book with a PPC, but I'm just wondering what the major gaps are.

I am also considering the UMPC, but I cringe at the thought of a Celeron 933 running Windows XP.

[griz326]

The ease of cut 'n paste alone is invaluable in terms of program juggling; the screen size is much easier on the eyes; the screen size also makes web browsing practical; and in the event you suffer a catastrophic failure with your Palm - where have you been backing/syncing up your system config? However, while it is true the Palm is more dependent on a host PC than the Samsung is...you'd still have to reinstall if Windows went belly up and for that you'd have to find a USB CDrom. (BTW - If there is a tool that allows you to sync/restore the Palm to/from an SD card - I'd like to know about it. Haven't found that program yet.)

It takes more knowledge than I possess to evaluate the differences between Pleco and Wenlin. I consider both programs EXCEPTIONAL tools. IMO, the limitations I can identify are imposed by the capabilities of the platform not the software.

*SET RAMBLIN' MODE ON*

As for the Samsung battery life, they're claiming the latest and greatest with the 32 gig memory card gets 3.5 hours battery life AND they now have a HUGE battery pack they claim provides 9 hours battery life.

It will be interesting to see the size/weight of the Samsung battery rechargers.

Consider these issues if you are traveling in China outside of modern cities:

* Is the electrical system reliable enough you won't fry your electronics? That's a MAJOR concern with the Palm TX because the battery is not user replaceable and the Palm must be plugged directly into the wall. Functional surge protectors are far to large and heavy to carry with you.

* How many recharging systems will you need to carry? I've got a battery charger for my camera and one for my TX. BTW - the little batteries used by the Kodak v610 would be perfect for the Palm TX...if...

* How will you recover from a crash?

* Can you recover from a hardware failure?

I'm basing my criteria on a six week trip starting in Guangzhou and circling around to Beijing by train. Because I will be writing a book, it is entirely possible I'll put my Newton back into service. It runs on regular batteries; is absolutely STABLE; and can retrieve my email. What more could a guy want? (Wenlin & Pleco!)

*SET RAMBLIN' MODE OFF*

[Jun Heng Clinic]

Hi folks.

Nice to see this thread come to life again.

I agree with the points both of you have made.

My replies/latest thoughts:-

1. Handheld+PlecoDict is a great combination for 'whipping' out at a second's notice and translating the odd word. But the advantage of Wenlin+PC is that it has a full Chinese text editor, which you can use to write Chinese or translate large bodies of text. Also, with a full PC you can load the enormous (as it is claimed) PowerWord translation software. (There is a Palm version of PowerWord, but Roddy thinks it is awefully cut down.) The only down-side I could find with Wenlin was that it might (?) not support one-handed use as easily as PlecoDict and Wenlin's flashcards do not support multiple-character words, but the Wenlin website outlines workaround solutions to the flashcard issue.

2. Yes, my total price for handheld+PlecoDict was high (did I say £600?). But I have some money to splash around and I like those accessories and buying new

3. Regarding screen size. Wenlin allows you to increase the pitch size of the characters by approx 2-fold (if I remember correctly). Bearing in mind that the Q1's screen is about half the diagonal size as a typical PC, I reckon you should be able to use Wenlin on the Q1 with the same overall pitch size - should not strain the eyes.

My personal conclusions at the moment are that: I need to both whip out a dictionary at a moment's notice AND do serious translation work - both activities on the move. In addition, I ALSO need access to large textbooks (which will break my back if I carry them everywhere). I have now decided that the Q1's 7" (diagonal) screen might be a tad too small for the serious translation and research, so I am buying a full-size tablet (maybe the Fujitsu convertible T4210). On this I will run Wenlin and PowerWord for translation and scan in various textbooks for study (either as graphics and/or OCR them). I will also use a handheld (just ordered the HP iPAQ 2790b) for its quick 'whip out' personal organizer and PlecoDict. I am also thinking about getting a scanner pen.

All the best, David

[roddy]

Ah yes, the popular 'Buy Everything!' solution. One of my personal favorites

[Jun Heng Clinic]

Yep, LOL.

[adrianlondon]

I have the IBM (now Lenovo) X41 thinkpad. It's thin, light and fantastically portable. If I'd bought the tablet version I'd probably take this around classes with me instead of my Palm with Plecodict. However, it's not pocket sized, so checking things in restaurants, or doing flashcards when bored on the bus to Carrefour, can only be done easily (and relatively unobtrusively) with the PDA.

[smalltownfart]

Jun Heng:

Sounds like you have sorted things out Too bad you didn't consider the Axim.

I have the Dell Axim x50v, and it (and the newer x51v) has a full VGA resolution screen - 640x480.

I believe the Samsung UMPC has 800x480, so it's not a big difference. Problem is that Pleco and most PDA software have yet to take full advantage of the screen size.

That made me wonder where the real gap was - would it be really be that hard to port WenLin to the PocketPC?

Pleco tries hard to be an all-in-one solution, but I think I still prefer WenLin's approach.

[griz326]

...actually Roddy, you do have to have a trial on everything to get the correct solution. When I worked in IT, we routinely conducted trials of new technologies. But the technology was provided by the vendor in the hope that we could use the technology in our environment and then buy it. As an individual, if you want to get the correct solution, you've got to buy it or have full access to the item to fully test it.

Now if you are going to buy a full size tablet, why not buy a good laptop? Stylus input is available on both types of systems...although with some laptops that requires 3rd party hardware.

As for the latest revision of Windows CE, stability remains a HUGE! issue...

[smalltownfart]

As for the latest revision of Windows CE, stability remains a HUGE! issue...

I've complained about this before, but to be fair, Dell seems to have sorted out the problems on x51v. I bought the x50v to avoid the WM5 problems, and a friend of mine went with X51v. He suffered for quite a while, but the last update (couple of months ago, I believe?) appears to have basically resolved the main issues.

[taobenli]

I've been following this thead with interest.I have thought about buying something like a PDA and Chinese dictionary/learning software for a long time but haven't known where to start. Whenever I start looking I get too overwhelmed! I am a grad student in the U.S., and since I am mostly a student of Korean my electronic Kor-Eng-Kor (with a handy additional Kor-Chinese-Kor extend card) has worked fine. But now I am thinking of seriously resuming my Chinese study (I studied for 5 years and stopped). I will need to be able to have a high quality dictionary with several methods of searching and I hope some learning software (flashcards, etc.). It would be nice, I guess, to be able to read articles on a handheld device, but I can do that on my laptop.

My laptop is a few years old and not lightweight at all! Just replacing it and getting something tiny would solve a lot of my problems (may not even need a handheld that way, just laptop software). But price is the issue for me.

What do folks recommend for the most cost-effective product?

Thanks!

[Jun Heng Clinic]

Hi taobenli

I only have a minute to post this quick reply - I can't check the details out I'm afraid.

I am assuming that you are thinking about a typical notebook-sized screen, ie 12.1" diagonal, rather than the new breeds of ultra mobile PCs coming out with 7" diagonal screens.

I don't know about their prices (they might be a bit too pricey) buy the smallest of the Sony range of notebooks look amazing - really powerful and light with good battery life.

Also the Fujitsu Lifebook P1510D (or something like that) has a screen of about 9" (ish) and has raving reviews. Only negative points about the P1510D were that the mouse nipple is awkward and the screen is passive - not so good for mobile use in my perosnal opinion.

If you're thinking more low budget then I don't have any ideas, I'm afraid, other than buyin second-hand or going for older models. Again maybe an older Sony notebook might by a good choice?

Personally, if I didn't feel that I needed a tablet (that I can balance on my lap with a book(s) ), then I would have purchased one of the very small Sony notebooks or the Fujitsu P1510D. (But I am going to buy a convertible tablet.)

HOWEVER, If you're thinking about an ultra-mobile PC with a much smaller screen (around 7" diagonal) then I think the Samsung Q1 (the HDD version, not the more recent SSD version) is great value for money, at around GBP 800.00 (inlcuding detatchable keyboard) is great value; and it runs full Windows XP. (Another version, the Q1b, supposed to be coming out soon, but I don't know anything about it - probably higher spec'd and very expensive.) There is another make and model which seems to compete with the Sumsung Q1 in screen-size, power and weight, the TabletKiosk eo v7110 , but I haven't read these reviews properly, so I might be leading you up the garden path here.

Personally, I'd leave the ultra-mobile PCs with screens less than 7" alone as I don't think the screen is practical to use.

Good luck in your searches. David

[griz326]

I take it you've got a clunker laptop.

You can buy a good and cheap laptop that will be faster, lighter, better, and newer than what you have today. Dell and Gateway are just two credible vendors, but Lenovo's are a level up on the pricing.

That said....try to delay your purchase. Among other things, there's a new Microsoft OS coming that kicks up hardware demands significantly. There will probably be some interesting new laptops and other technologies that fall out of this change. You might also find high end laptops today selling for CHEAP because they won't run Vista. (There is a school of thought that Vista will see slow growth because of intense hardware demands and the fact that many existing applications will need to be upgraded/replaced.)

I recommend you stick with a full featured notebook from a reliable vendor. Those of us who chase new technology often demonstrate that we have more money than brains. ;)

Additionally, stay away from proprietary laptops. For instance, Sony used to sell their Picturebook (I have four of them) with a restore CD that would only run from a Sony CD player...so if your system crapped out, you had to buy a Sony CD player to restore it. I do not know if they continue with that strategy.

There are some really sexy gadgets available today, but unless you live-eat-breathe technology, I recommend keeping it simple by sticking with proven stuff.

[rpday]

I realize the discussion has drifted from software to hardware, but I feel compelled to make two points in favor of Plecodict.

1. The abilty to look up characters on the street (versus downloading texts) is much better. Not only because you are working with a piece of hardware (Palm or Pocket PC) which understands a stylus, but also because the software is more tolerant of alternate stroke order. Wenlin rejects all but its expected stroke order on word look up.

2. Flashcards. Wenlin accepts only one way for their use. While it may be educationally sound for that choice, Pleco allows a near infinite variety of setups for review and testing.

[griz326]

Pleco is great on the Palm. Wenlin is great on desktop. Both tools are exceptional, but both also have short-comings.

Here is my #1 issue with each of them:

*** Pleco cannot quickly cut & paste Chinese characters into a word processing document. I know it can be done, but I've not found a quick way to do it. I think it is a limitation of the Palm interface.

*** Wenlin dictionary look up closes after every use and the quick lookup won't allow you to grab from the quick lookup window. This makes unnecessarily difficult to look up words when trying to write in Chinese characters. (BTW-Wenlin is a potentially great word processor if the DEV team wanted to go in that direction.)

I'm certain there are more issues with each of them, but my use of these tools is task-based. (I haven't used the handwriting recognition on Wenlin.)

In any event - both are exceptional products.

[smalltownfart]

1. The abilty to look up characters on the street (versus downloading texts) is much better. Not only because you are working with a piece of hardware (Palm or Pocket PC) which understands a stylus, but also because the software is more tolerant of alternate stroke order. Wenlin rejects all but its expected stroke order on word look up.

2. Flashcards. Wenlin accepts only one way for their use. While it may be educationally sound for that choice, Pleco allows a near infinite variety of setups for review and testing.

rpday:

Agree with you on both points. The wenlin character input is quite unusable, but you can use the latest microsoft MSPY, it's free and includes pen input as well.

But I am not happy with the plecodict pen input or the pleco flashcards.

I find Hanwang too basic, I still prefer to use monster chinese. The flashcards thing is also pretty basic. There is no way to "age" or have a more useful way to automatically manage flashcards for review like supermemo. To me, to pay for these 2 extra features that I already have on my PocketPC was very irritating. Pleco also does not allow for any way to integrate its content with an external app, eg show an entry on demand for a third-party program.

To me, the best thing about these 2 programs is the content (the ABC dictionary).

WenLin's interface is a bit unorthodox, but it seems to make sense after you get the hang of it. Pleco's lookup interface is, in my opinion, still a bit raw & not quite up to the level of MDict (freely available). But Version 2.0 is promising to bring big improvements, so I'm keeping my fingers crossed...