Is CUCAS legit?

[nye307]

I was originally looking at going into teaching in China and learning the language on the side but have decided a semester of intensive Mandarin prior to that would probably be advisable. At any rate, I've been looking around and stumbled on to this admissions system for Chinese universities: http://www.cucas.edu.cn/. Judging by the immaculate English on the website it looks on the up and up but giving my information out to random organizations in China worries me a little bit. Does this look like a legit service or should I go about applying a different way?

[edelweis]

You can do a search with the search box at the top left of this page. Just enter CUCAS and press the "search" button.

[kdavid]

I've written about them elsewhere. To reiterate my main points:

1. The live help wasn't very helpful for me. I inquired about an MA program at HIT Harbin. They had no information. They said they'd contact the professors and get back to me. They never got back to me. I logged back on and asked several times (over several weeks) the same questions. In the end, I was told the professors at HIT didn't have the answers to the questions I was asking, which were quite simple; e.g. specific course titles, textbooks, etc. It was very clear CUCAS wasn't doing the work, or didn't have efficient enough systems to get the answers I needed.

2. A friend of mine registered at a university through them. My friend was then told to visit the university in person to register for classes. After she arrived, she had to do all of the paperwork CUCAS had made her do again, plus pay all of the registration fees again.

While they do appear extremely well organized and laid out, I'm pretty sure they're still run entirely by Chinese. It's a great idea, and a fantastic vision, but without the proper management, communication guidelines, infrastructure and networking, the site will likely not succeed.

[nye307]

Thanks for the information kdavid. Well, I've tried HYCC instead as they seem to have gotten good reviews on this forum, but they haven't gotten back to me. Unfortunately it seems that it may be near impossible to apply myself as Liaoning Normal University's english website doesn't have it's hyperlinks enabled. Does anyone have any suggestions on other organizations to go through for this sort of thing? What are the odds someone at LNU may speak enough English to guide me through the process if I call? (I'm assuming slim to none)

[roddy]

Try it and see. It's also worth faxing them a request for information via email, daft thought it sounds.

[hyy87]

Hi guys,

I work for CUCAS and we are legit! (Check out our link on the Ministry of Education’s CERNET English website - orange banner, top right. Also, note that our domain name ends in edu.cn).

CUCAS was set up about two years ago under the auspices of the Ministry of Education, with the aim of making it easier for international students to apply to Chinese universities. (If you’ve ever applied to a Chinese university – as I have – you will understand why an organization like CUCAS is necessary). The main thing CUCAS does is run an online admissions system and a searchable database of programs at Chinese universities so you can find a suitable program and apply for it online. If you’re familiar with applying for university in the UK, CUCAS is like UCAS but Chinese and for laowai. (Not all of China’s universities have co-operation agreements with us, but we currently have over 150 schools in our system and counting).

The processing fee CUCAS charges is US$30. This covers our costs (staff, office space etc.). Applicants also have to pay the application fee for each university they apply for. This fee goes to the university, and you’d have to pay it regardless of whether or not you apply through CUCAS. There are no hidden charges. The only other fee we charge is for the airport pick-up, which you’re free to not book.

What are the advantages of using CUCAS over a commercial agent?

1. CUCAS is not a commercial agent, but an official organization with much closer ties to universities and the Ministry of Education. Applications sent through our system get prioritized.

2. US$30 is a fraction of what most agents charge. For example, HYCC’s application service costs US$125. All the services included in that package are also offered by CUCAS for $30.

Granted, CUCAS doesn’t offer the more comprehensive services (like finding an apartment, setting up a bank account), but as a laowai who’s been through all that, I would personally recommend you dive into the China experience. Don’t get mollycoddled from the get-go. You’ll miss out on so much of what makes China…well, China – mafan and all.

What are the advantages of using CUCAS over directly applying to the university?

1. The application process is entirely online, you don’t have to worry about your application getting lost or delayed in the mail.

2. You can pay via Paypal. (There are three other payment methods if you don’t use Paypal).

3. Our support staff speak English and give much better service than you’d get from most university admissions offices.

Over 1000 students have successfully applied to Chinese universities through CUCAS. I’m sorry to hear that kdavid wasn’t satisfied with his experience using CUCAS but let me address those complaints now.

1. The information we have about universities and their programs all come from the universities themselves. When we get an enquiry from a student about a program, we ask the university. Unfortunately, universities don’t always get back to us, despite repeated attempts. You are of course free to ask universities yourselves, and you may wonder why CUCAS is necessary if we can’t get all the answers. Well, if you don’t speak good Chinese, CUCAS is much more likely to get a response than questions asked in English. CUCAS is also the university’s business partner. It’s in their interest to maintain a good relationship with us.

2. Your friend who applied for a program through CUCAS ended up registering for a different program to the one she originally applied for. In accordance with Chinese university bureaucracy, this is 不行。It sucks that the university made her pay the registration fee again. Just to be clear to everyone else, CUCAS did not ask her to pay the CUCAS fee again.

And yes, CUCAS is run by Chinese. That means we have local knowledge, better guanxi, and speak perfect Chinese. You want us on your side.

http://www.cucas.edu.cn

[China_Checker]

http://www.onlinethreatalerts.com/article/2014/3/18/chinese-domain-name-registration-scams/0.jpg

 

I just got this scam warning by email this morning and it is run by a former Chinese government official who uses the English name of "Peter". The details of this elaborate scam are explained at http://ChinaScamPatrol.wordpress.com

[roddy]

Merged. FWIW (and for full disclosure) CUCAS have been advertising on here for years. Any comments from regulars using the service lately? this was the most recent report I spotted.

[China_Checker]

I notice that CUCAS advertises on this website and nobody is posting any of the negative stuff that pops up all over the internet about CUCAS when you google "Cucas, scam, problems, fraud, complaints"  (There are over 20 negative posts/links going back to 2011 at Complaintsboard.com, etc). Is this a coincidence or a conflict of interest?  Does Chinese-forums.com deny what is stated by China Scam Patrol? Can Admin here please confirm or deny that CUCAS is or is not part of the Ministry or Education of China and if they pay money to advertise on this forum?  Thank you.

[imron]

if they pay money to advertise on this forum?

In the post that pointed you to this thread, Roddy already confirmed that they advertise on the site, and have been doing so for years.

 

As a relatively new member, you probably aren't aware of how we run things here, but long-standing policy of the forums is not to offer advertisers any control of posts that they don't like, and neither will we be pressured from advertisers to remove negative content (in the past we have turned advertisers away because of this).  Nor do advertisers get any sort of preferential treatment.  We are also very strict about making sure anyone promoting a company/service discloses any relationship/connection they have with that company/service.

 

There are negative posts regarding CUCAS on the forums, however we also encourage companies to participate in the discussion and provide their own side of the story if they have issue with any sort of post, because we trust that readers can use their intelligence to make up their own mind. 

 

If you google "<company name> scam, problems, fraud, complaint" you're almost certain to get results for any company you choose.  I wouldn't necessarily use that as the only measure of whether or not a company was reputable.

 

 

 

Does Chinese-forums.com deny what is stated by China Scam Patrol? Can Admin here please confirm or deny that CUCAS is or is not part of the Ministry or Education of China

Unfortunately we have no contacts at the Ministry of Education nor any means to confirm whether or not CUCAS is a part of them.  I believe in their own posts they do not claim to be part of the MoE, but rather set up "under the auspices of" whatever that means.

 

Regarding China Scam Patrol, it's not chinese-forums.com's job or purpose to confirm or deny statements made by random sites on the Internet.

 

I do however find it curious that a site that was dormant for a year suddenly had a new post 1 week ago, and then suddenly a new member to the forums (also only 1 week ago) starts asking about it, especially when that site and its related sites are about checking/investigating companies in china, and that new member is called china_checker

 

Can your confirm or deny whether you have any connection to China Scam Patrol, Clever China Cheaters and/or International Recovery Service?

[roddy]

Moved the above two posts in here, we can keep the 'discussion' in one place...

 

Edit: Wow, there's even a seminar. You're a busy man, China_Checker

[tysond]

http://www.google.com.hk/#q=mother+theresa+fraud&safe=strict

[Yorin]

 

I notice that CUCAS advertises on this website and nobody is posting any of the negative stuff that pops up all over the internet about CUCAS when you google "Cucas, scam, problems, fraud, complaints"  (There are over 20 negative posts/links going back to 2011 at Complaintsboard.com, etc). Is this a coincidence or a conflict of interest?  Does Chinese-forums.com deny what is stated by China Scam Patrol? Can Admin here please confirm or deny that CUCAS is or is not part of the Ministry or Education of China and if they pay money to advertise on this forum?  Thank you.

 

This is beginning to sound a little paranoid. I could understand if you'd personally had a problem with that company. If this is the case, maybe you'd like to tell us about that. It would surely be more informative than making such a fuss about a link that supposedly got mailed to you (by whom - does he know more about it?)

[China_Checker]

Well admin's comments are reassuring but the things I am reading online are very unethical. CUCAS sales people did in fact tell me they were "a division of China's Ministry of Education" but I spoke with the public affairs office of MOE and they vehemently deny that CUCAS or their sister company Beijing ChiWest are in anyway part of their ministry.  Here are two of over 20 links about these two companies. SInce CUCAS advertises here they should be asked to explain why they use ILLEGAL domain names since they are neither a university nor part of the MOE.

 

http://chinabusinessandschoolblacklist.blogspot.com/2014/03/fraud-alert-beijing-chiwest-cucas-study.html

 

http://chinascampatrol.wordpress.com

 

Also we all know that the "work abroad" review sites are all mercenary companies that let you praise your own company if you pay their fee.

[Yorin]

 

http://chinabusiness...ucas-study.html

 

Dude... this was published less than an hour, possibly just minutes before you posting the link here, as anyone hovering over the "Mar 27" icon on that site can see.

 

You sure are quick at coming up with these links.

[imron]

From your website:

 

CUCAS even uses legitimate expat forums and web sites like Chinese-Forums.com to advertise for him. Former clients of CUCAS who attempt to post complaints on forums where CUCAS advertises report having their warnings and complaints deleted within an hour of posting them.

 

If you are talking about chinese-forums doing that, I can assure you posts are only deleted if they fall foul of our terms and conditions or fail to meet community standards.  Advertisers have no influence over moderation.

 

Having said that, you are currently dangerously close to having further posts of yours deleted.  This is nothing to do with complaining about CUCAS, rather, as per our guidelines for commercial posters, we ask that posters declare any relationship or connection they have to sites they are promoting or linking to, which is something you are clearly not doing.

 

Just so we're 100% clear, you and anyone else are welcome to post legitimate complaints about CUCAS or any of our other advertisers here and they won't be deleted, but if you are posting just to drive up traffic to your own sites, especially when you are not acknowledging your connection to those sites, then those posts will be deleted.

 

Also, just to be clear, if you register a few dummy accounts and suddenly start posting complaints from 'former clients' of CUCAS, those posts will be deleted.  Not because they complain about an advertiser, but because we were not born yesterday and this is a moderated forum that doesn't like spam.  This does not constitute proof that we delete complaints about advertisers, rather it constitutes proof that we delete spam and try to provide a meaningful platform for discussion, not a platform for trolls.

 

 

SInce CUCAS advertises here they should be asked to explain why they use ILLEGAL domain names since they are neither a university nor part of the MOE.

 

There are plenty of companies who advertise on Chinese-forums.  Some of them also post here regularly.  It's up to them to respond if they wish.  Feel free to email them and point them to the discussion and ask them to respond.

[jbradfor]

 

you are currently dangerously close to having your posts deleted.

 

Please don't do that.  These posts have spoken volumes to me on how much attention to pay to China Scam Patrol.  In fact, I request you lock his posts from editing.

[imron]

Please don't do that.

For clarity, I was referring to new posts.  I'll edit my original post.

[China_Checker]

Okay, forget what I say and do your own homework. Google "CUCAS, problems, scam, complaints," and see what you find on your own. I also verified that the "Service Company" (BEIJING CHIWEST) that CUCAS tells everyone they have to pay is also owned by the same guy who owns CUCAS. Although he uses the name "Peter". The licensing records at SAIC (you can check yourself online) say both are "for profit" companies owned by a Zheng Tian Ying.  I rest my case and will be moving along to more pleasant topics. Btw... I am not the only one concerned about CUCAS if you look at this link: https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20140320183521AA9YHIk

 

I am even more concerned that CUCAS does not even defend themselves and explain to us how they got their "university" and "government" domains.

[roddy]

Yawn. Lets look at this Yahoo Answers question you've linked to...

 

Asked by "JP" one week ago. Who's asked three questions in total, all about Chinese scams targeting foreigners. Incidentally, 'one week ago', was when lots of new posters got "concerned" about CUCAS here. And here and here and who knows elsewhere. Did thebeijinger just delete the post? Sensible folk...

 

Then we can take a look at the answers. 

 

From Liz.... who some months back happened to be linking to your favourite site here. Is cleverchinacheaters yours? Very lucky she should respond so quickly. 

 

And Hellen, who happened to link to that wordpress site, and to various scam / blacklist sites - any of those yours? -  months back. Very lucky she should respond so quickly also. 

 

 

CUCAS were going to respond here, I told them not to waste their time.

 

We're going to stick you in moderation. If you manage to make any credible posts, we'll look at them. But if it's still "advised Interpol" (AFAIK you need to be a national police agency to get Interpol to listen) and "verifying" that CUCAS and Chiwest are the same organisation (bit late, the Chiwest company name was in the footer of their site in 2010 and is still there today...) well, you're wasting our time.

Just to reiterate what Imron's already said: advertising on here gets you no editorial privileges. Despite the insinuations otherwise, the very fact this "discussion" has been allowed to take place speaks against it.

Financially, I do not have an interest here. If CUCAS stopped advertising I have other advertisers who would happily fill the slot at pretty much the same price. We don't particularly endorse them, but that's the same for all our advertisers.