First Episode 29: 走向共和 (Towards the Republic)

A part of the Grand First Episode Project -- See this thread for more info.

youku

From the previous thread: "The epic depicts the historical events dating from 1894 to 1924 and concentrated on the life of Empress Dowager, Li Hung Chang, Yuan Shih Kai and Sun Yat Sen."

We are a week behind, but it matters not, we can take it from here. This one is at upper intermediate level language-wise, but with lots of historical characters and references, so I'd probably mess it up if I tried to summarise it. You can refer to the previous thread for some more background information.

Still, I've heard only great things about this drama, and I think it's worth seeing it for all the people who weren't here back in 2003. The atmosphere is quite different from many historical shows, you can see that the empire is in a bad state, and it's an interesting contrast between the majestic scenery of the Forbidden City and the solemn mood of the imperial court.

Edited February 9, 2010 at 02:09 PM by renzhe

A quick update -- I've rewatched this and gathered the interesting/difficult vocab. This show is only really suitable for upper-intermediate to advanced people anyway, so I laid off the easy stuff.

I'll probably try to look these up one of these days, but I expect that many will be hard to find, so I'm thankful for any assistance here.

Characters:

太后 tài hòu Empress Dowager

丁汝昌 Ding Ruchang (1836-1895), commander of the Qing North China Navy

袁世凯 Yuán Shì kǎi Yuan Shikai (1859-1916), senior general of late Qing, subsequently warlord and self-proclaimed emperor of China

李鸿章 Lǐ Hóng zhāng Li Hung-chang or Li Hongzhang (1823-1901), Qing dynasty general, politician and diplomat (李中堂)

翁同龢 （翁师傅）

朱洪武

沈英子 a prostitute and 袁世凯's lover

杏荪

阎敬铬

Vocab:

主力舰 zhǔ lì jiàn battleship

威远 Wēi yuǎn (N) Weiyuan (place in Sichuan)

证实 zhèng shí to confirm (sth to be true) / to verify

步骤 bù zhòu step / move / measure

攻占 gōng zhàn attack and occupy

朝鲜 Cháo xiǎn geographic term for Korea

跳板 tiào bǎn springboard / jumping-off point

占领 zhàn lǐng to occupy (a territory) / to hold

湖广 Hú guǎng Hubei and Hunan provinces (a Ming dynasty province)

总督 zǒng dū governor-general / person in charge of a foreign possession or territory

汉阳 Hàn yáng Hanyang county in Hubei province

铁厂 tiě chǎng steel factory

皆可 jiē kě both OK / all acceptable

朝野 cháo yě all levels of society / the imperial court and the ordinary people

喧嚣 xuān xiāo to clamor / to make noise

鹦鹉 yīng wǔ parrot

懿旨 yì zhǐ an Imperial decree

搪塞 táng sāi - to stall somebody with a vague answer

逢迎 féng yíng to meet face to face

颐和园 yí hé yuán Summer Palace (in Beijing)

遮风挡雨 zhē fēng bì yǔ a shelter from the wind and rain

提携 tí xié to lead by the hand / to guide / to support

琵琶 pí pá - lute

赎 shú - redeem

顺遂 shùn suì everything is going smoothly

绌 chù crimson silk / deficiency / to stitch

水师 shuǐ shī navy (in Qing times)

丛生 cóng shēng growing as a thicket / overgrown / breaking out everywhere (of disease, social disorder etc)

清流 Qīng liú (N) Qingliu (place in Fujian)

眉睫 méi jié eyebrows and eyelashes / nearby

结草衔环 jié cǎo xián huán deep gratitude up to death

做主 zuò zhǔ make the decision / take charge of / back up / support

纳闷 nà mèn puzzled / bewildered

体恤 tǐ xù to empathize with / to show solicitude for

囫囵 hú lún complete / whole

舒坦 shū tan comfortable / at ease

训斥 xùn chì to reprimand / to rebuke / to berate

禀 bǐng natural property or endowment / report to (a superior)

屠户 tú hù butcher

I haven't had much luck with these:

均系旧式

尚需尾炮

垂顾

奴才

孰轻孰重

秦琼卖马

讨米叫花

腾龙

苍天垂怜

徒麽国

贵胄掣时

物议

颇难挪移 -- hard to move ??

经坛经棚

牌楼戏台

江山社稷

腻甭这个

剿捻子

水旱灾疫 natural catastrophes (floods, droughts, etc.) ??

Edited September 24, 2008 at 09:08 AM by renzhe

Just been watching the first two episodes - very classy stuff, can't fault anything about it - locations are gorgeous, and the actors are all great fun - the looks on everyones faces when the parrot won't speak are classic. Not sure I'll get through the whole thing (actually it's inevitable I won't) as it's 60 episodes, but that's me, not the show.

Consider -

均系旧式 - 系=是; all are old fashioned/of old models

奴才 - servant (derog)

孰轻孰重 - which is unimportant, which is important

秦琼卖马 - being forced to do what one doesn't want to do but there is no alternative -> http://star.aust.edu.cn/jpkc/fyllysj/xiazai/1.2.ppt#391,117,秦叔宝卖马——穷途末路

讨米叫花 - 叫花=叫化=乞丐；讨米=beg for food

苍天垂怜 - the heaven to show pity to human

颇难挪移 - rather hard to remove

牌楼戏台 - decorated archway and stage

江山社稷 - the country and the land

懿旨 yì zhǐ an Imperial decree

but from a female leader, like the queen or the queen dowager. That from the emperor would be a 聖旨.

逢迎 féng yíng to meet face to face

should be to ingratiate.

清流 Qīng liú (N) Qingliu (place in Fujian)

depending on the context, it could mean a clear stream which refers to someone respectable among not so respectable people (濁流); scholars who keep away from politics.

Thanks for the explanations, skylee! It's always nice to understand the missing parts.

I think it's great they've done incredibly bad dubbing for the incredibly bad foreign actors. Good to see consistency.

I'm making slow progress on this, up to episode 6 - it's good stuff, and I can watch Cixi all day, especially when she's talking about 张之洞的折子. No, I don't know why, I just like the way it sounds.

尚需尾炮 - still need 尾炮 - cannons on the stern of the boat, I guess?

徒麽国 - no idea, but your post is the only result on Google

物议 - criticism from the people

水旱灾疫, floods, droughts and disease

I'm up to about episode 20 of this now - not making particularly quick progress, and I have to admit that if you were to quiz me on the finer points of the plot I'd probably fail miserably as I'm not always paying full attention, but it's good stuff. Would certainly recommend this for anyone looking for some historical court intrigue.

李鸿章（李中堂） is, for me and so far, the glue that holds it together. One of my favourite scenes is at about 32:15 in episode 12 when (after a brush with a bullet) he tells the Japanese to come and have a go if they think they're hard enough. 入侵吧！

I'm still watching this, why isn't anyone else?

If anything this is just getting better. 李鸿章's now moved on, but 袁世凯 is really coming into his own - I just watched . . episode 31 I think - and you've got two brilliant scenes where he sorts out the disorder over the women's school and then talks with 张之洞 about getting rid of the 科举. And the reunion between 张之洞 and 太后 is sweet too.

There's a real sense of history to the whole thing. One thing I think would have been nice is to have a couple of 'grassroots' characters caught up in the events - think

in Rome. It does have some similar bits - there's one fantastic scene earlier, can't remember which episode, where a stallholder explains to his hired help that China's just like this soup - you can invade it as much as you want, it's still going to be soup. But the regular characters are all known historical ones.

I'm still watching this, why isn't anyone else?

Too difficult, basically.

I can follow, but fully appreciating it would take too much pausing and dictionary lookups, and I can't afford the time right now.

I'll revisit some of these shows once I improve a bit.

Fair enough. I'll happily admit that while I'm enjoying it, in some ways I'm just skimming it - I'm not always paying full attention, and some of the court stuff - which there's a lot of - gets lost.

I am glad that you are watching it. It's good stuff. 加油.

Yep, not sure I'd have stuck with it if it wasn't for your high praise - it's useful to know that it's not just good at the start. . .

You get some good laughs out of this as well - just finished 38 when Yuan Shikai insists on proper legal process, even if the 'public prosecutor' and 'judge' signs do have to be put in front of the same person.

I'm also noticing some foreshadowing, and I suspect on a second watch I'd notice lots more and it would all hang together much more closely. For example around episode 31 there are a couple of odd scenes where the camera goes out of its way to show us a young boy's cock and balls, notably as he's happily pissing out of a moving carriage. It just seems a weird thing to opt to show at the time, but it makes more sense a few episodes later when . . . well, lets just hope he enjoyed it while he had it. And this all runs alongside decisions about keeping the palace eunuch system.

I'm still not quite two thirds of the way through, but I'm pretty confident I'll finish this, adding it to a fairly short list of Chinese TV shows I've actually managed to stick with to the end. I could even see myself watching the whole thing again quite happily, if and when I have the time and attention span - I'm sure there's a lot more I'd pick up on, and there are so many characters and so much intrigue that I can't pretend to know everything that's going on.

Renzhe, I want to see you watching this next year.

I think the Yuan Shikai character in this series is cute.

I've lent the DVDs to my boss so I can't rewatch it with you. Too bad.

Not sure I'll get through the whole thing (actually it's inevitable I won't) as it's 60 episodes, but that's me, not the show.

I finished it!

Overall, this is quality stuff, and if you can handle the language I wholeheartedly recommend all forty hours of it. Absolutely epic, with some fantastic performances - any scene where you've got any two of 慈禧，袁世凯，李鸿章 and 孙中山 is guaranteed to sizzle.

I felt it fell off slightly once we had the republic - the court scenes were fantastic, and while there was still plenty of politicking it didn't have the same weight. Also, once 袁世凯 is actually in power I think a lot of the fun goes out of the character - before that he's got a brilliant devil-may-care, 'lets bring down the Qing, it'll be a laugh' atttitude, which I think gets lost. But it still has more than enough momentum, and there's so much of import going on, that it rides over any potholes and ends up in a barnstormer of a speech by 孙中山 - I presume this is what was cut on the mainland.

If I ever have time this is one of those shows I'd sit down and rewatch - partially as I know I wasn't paying full attention right the way through, and couldn't place many of the minor characters in their rightful places - who is who's 弟子 and so on. But there's also some really nice touches I spotted, and many I probably didn't - one being 孙中山 taking a moment out from fleeing an assassination attempt to shake a pesky pebble out of his shoe - that I think it would hold up to rewatching.

Worth learning Chinese for.

Worth learning Chinese for.

Must be worth a look ...

I got a language question.

There are many scenes with servants reading aloud the empress's decree to high officials. They are literally reading it out word by word. Are these decrees written in 文言 ? I find them pretty hard to understand or rather it takes awhile to make sense what the decree is saying since the language is extremely concise and high prose (at my level anyway(.

I finally finished this! I agree with Roddy that this is worth learning Chinese for; it was in order to have access to this sort of material that I got my Chinese to the level where I could follow it. It is good stuff.

As an ignorant 老外, as well as the considerable entertainment value, I found this show really good for showing the principles and ideals of 孙中山 and others on which modern China has been partly based. They are closer than I expected to the principles and ideals on which Western democracies are based. The process of modernisation and opening up to the West is also good to watch. I have just taken out a loan myself so I particularly enjoyed watching 慈禧 trying to borrow money from HSBC. I feel that we have a lot in common.

李鸿章（李中堂） is, for me and so far, the glue that holds it together. One of my favourite scenes is at about 32:15 in episode 12 when (after a brush with a bullet) he tells the Japanese to come and have a go if they think they're hard enough. 入侵吧！

李鸿章 is gold. (Trivia point - he is a close adoptive relative of 张爱玲). I really liked the Japanese 明治天皇 as well - he had a kind of spooky psycho charisma and I was disappointed not to see more of him. The Sino-Japanese war scenes were really well done and showed the pressure growing on the 清.

Also, once 袁世凯 is actually in power I think a lot of the fun goes out of the character - before that he's got a brilliant devil-may-care, 'lets bring down the Qing, it'll be a laugh' atttitude, which I think gets lost.

One of my favourite bits is where 袁世凯 agrees with this - he says that being 大总统 of a 共和 is like being Monkey Magic with the golden bands around his head - anytime he wants to do something, 孙中山 says the magic words, the bands tighten and he has to give up on whatever he wants to do.

But like you say, any scene where you've got any two of 慈禧，袁世凯，李鸿章 and 孙中山 is guaranteed to sizzle, and I think that the post-Republic scenes with both 袁世凯 and 孙中山 are arguably the best part of the series.

But there's also some really nice touches I spotted

Yes, lots of them. I'm just now remembering that bit at the end where 张勋 gets in trouble for calling his 辫子 a pigtail ...

well done. congratulations.